Onward Christian Soldiers ...

Theresa sent me this since it was circulating withing Dow. My response was:

 

All together now .... "Onward Christian Soldiers, Marching as to ...."

 

Simplistic but confident. Awards from Reagan don't really count in my book. This rationale got us into Iraq and generates salute induced concussions. Sad

 

Very depressing.

 

That said, enjoy...

 

Herb Meyer served during the Reagan administration as special assistant to the Director of Central Intelligence and Vice Chairman of the CIA's National Intelligence Council. In these positions, he managed production of the U.S. National Intelligence Estimates and other top-secret projections for the President and his national security advisers. Meyer is widely credited with being the first senior U.S. Government official to forecast the collapse of the Soviet Union for which he later was awarded the U.S. National Intelligence Distinguished Service Medal, the intelligence community's highest honor. Formerly an associate editor of FORTUNE, he is also the author of several books.

 

WHAT IN THE WORLD IS GOING ON?

 

A GLOBAL INTELLIGENCE BRIEFING FOR CEOS

 

HERBERT MEYER

 

FOUR MAJOR TRANSFORMATIONS

 

Currently, there are four major transformations that are shaping political, economic and world events. These transformations have profound implications for American business owners, our culture and our way of life.

 

1. The War in Iraq

 

There are three major monotheistic religions in the world: Christianity, Judaism and Islam. In the 16th century, Judaism and Christianity reconciled with the modern world. The rabbis, priests and scholars found a way to settle up and pave the way forward. Religion remained at the center of life, church and state became separate. Rule of law, idea of economic liberty, individual rights, human rights - all these are defining points of modern Western civilization. These concepts started with the Greeks but didn't take off until the 15th and 16th century when Judaism and Christianity found a way to reconcile with the modern world. When that happened, it unleashed the scientific revolution and the greatest outpouring of art, literature and music the world has ever known.

 

Islam, which developed in the 7th century, counts millions of Moslems around the world who are normal people. However, there is a radical streak within Islam. When the radicals are in charge, Islam attacks Western civilization. Islam first attacked Western civilization in the 7th century, and later in the 16th and 17th centuries. By 1683, the Moslems (Turks from the Ottoman Empire ) were literally at the gates of Vienna . It was in Vienna that the climactic battle between Islam and Western civilization took place. The West won and went forward. Islam lost and went backward. Interestingly, the date of that battle was September 11. Since them, Islam has not found a way to reconcile with the modern world.

 

Today, terrorism is the third attack on Western civilization by radical Islam. To deal with terrorism, the U.S. is doing two things. First, units of our armed forces are in 30 countries around the world hunting down terrorist groups and dealing with them. This gets very little publicity. Second we are taking military action in Afghanistan and Iraq. These are covered relentlessly by the media.

 

People can argue about whether the war in Iraq is right or wrong. However, the underlying strategy behind the war is to use our military to remove the radicals from power and give the moderates a chance. Our hope is that, over time, the moderates will find a way to bring Islam forward into the 21st century. That's what our involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan is all about.

 

The lesson of 9/11 is that we live in a world where a small number of people can kill a large number of people very quickly. They can use airplanes, bombs, anthrax, chemical weapons or dirty bombs. Even with a first-rate intelligence service (which the U.S. does not have), you can't stop every attack. That means our tolerance for political horseplay has dropped to zero. No longer will we play games with terrorists or weapons of mass destructions.

 

Most of the instability and horseplay is coming from the Middle East. That's why we have thought that if we could knock out the radicals and give the moderates a chance to hold power, they might find a way to reconcile Islam with the modern world. So when looking at Afghanistan or Iraq, it's important to look for any signs that they are modernizing. For example, women being brought into the workforce and colleges in Afghanistan are good. The Iraqis stumbling toward a constitution is good. People can argue about what the U.S. is doing and how we're doing it, but anything that suggests Islam is finding its way forward is good.

 

2. The Emergence of China

 

In the last 20 years, China has moved 250 million people from the farms and villages into the cities. Their plan is to move another 300 million in the next 20 years. When you put that many people into the cities, you have to find work for them. That's why China is addicted to manufacturing; they have to put all the relocated people to work. When we decide to manufacture something in the U.S. , it's based on market needs and the opportunity to make a profit. In China, they make the decision because they want the jobs, which is a very different calculation.

 

While China is addicted to manufacturing, Americans are addicted to low prices. As a result, a unique kind of economic codependency has developed between the two countries. If we ever stop buying from China , they will explode politically. If China stops selling to us, our economy will take a huge hit because prices will jump. We are subsidizing their economic development; they are subsidizing our economic growth.

 

Because of their huge growth in manufacturing, China is hungry for raw materials which drives prices up worldwide. China is also thirsty for oil, which is one reason oil is now at $60 a barrel. By 2020, China will produce more cars than the U.S. China is also buying its way into the oil infrastructure around the world. They are doing it in the open market and paying fair market prices, but millions of barrels of oil that would have gone to the U.S. are now going to China. China's quest to assure it has the oil it needs to fuel its economy is a major factor in world politics and economics. We have our Navy fleets protecting the sea lines, specifically the ability to get the tankers through. It won't be long before the Chinese have an aircraft carrier sitting in the Persian Gulf as well. The question is, will their aircraft carrier be pointing in the same direction as ours or against us?

 

3. Shifting Demographics of Western Civilization

 

Most countries in the Western world have stopped breeding. For a civilization obsessed with sex, this is remarkable. Maintaining a steady population requires a birth rate of 2.1. In Western Europe, the birth rate currently stands at 1.5, or 30 percent below replacement. In 30 years there will be 70 to 80 million fewer Europeans than there are today. The current birth rate in Germany is 1.3. Italy and Spain are even lower at 1.2. At that rate, the working age population declines by 30 percent in 20 years, which has a huge impact on the economy.

 

When you don't have young workers to replace the older ones, you have to import them. The European countries are currently importing Moslems. Today, the Moslems comprise 10 percent of France and Germany, and the percentage is rising rapidly because they have higher birthrates. However, the Moslem populations are not being integrated into the cultures of their host countries, which is a political catastrophe. One reason Germany and France don't support the Iraq war is they fear their Moslem populations will explode on them. By 2020, more than half of all births in the Netherlands will be non-European. The huge design flaw in the post-modern secular state is that you need a traditional religious society birth rate to sustain it. The Europeans simply don't wish to have children, so they are dying.

 

In Japan , the birthrate is 1.3. As a result, Japan will lose up to 60 million people over the next 30 years. Because Japan has a very different society than Europe , they refuse to import workers. Instead, they are just shutting down. Japan has already closed 2000 schools, and is closing them down at the rate of 300 per year. Japan is also aging very rapidly. By 2020, one out of every five Japanese will be at least 70 years old. Nobody has any idea about how to run an economy with those demographics.

 

Europe and Japan , which comprise two of the world's major economic engines, aren't merely in recession, they're shutting down. This will have a huge impact on the world economy, and it is already beginning to happen. Why are the birthrates so low? There is a direct correlation between abandonment of traditional religious society and a drop in birth rate, and Christianity in Europe is becoming irrelevant.

 

The second reason is economic. When the birth rate drops below replacement, the population ages. With fewer working people to support more retired people, it puts a crushing tax burden on the smaller group of working age people. As a result, young people delay marriage and having a family. Once this trend starts, the downward spiral only gets worse. These countries have abandoned all the traditions they formerly held in regards to having families and raising children.

 

The U.S. birth rate is 2.0, just below replacement. We have an increase in population because of immigration. When broken down by ethnicity, the Anglo birth rate is 1.6 (same as France ) while the Hispanic birth rate is 2.7. In the U.S. , the baby boomers are starting to retire in massive numbers. This will push the elder dependency ratio from 19 to 38 over the next 10 to 15 years. This is not as bad as Europe , but still represents the same kind of trend.

 

Western civilization seems to have forgotten what every primitive society understands-you need kids to have a healthy society. Children are huge consumers. Then they grow up to become taxpayers. That's how a society works, but the post-modern secular state seems to have forgotten that. If U.S. birth rates of the past 20 to 30 years had been the same as post-World War II, there would be no Social Security or Medicare problems.

 

The world's most effective birth control device is money. As society creates a middle class and women move into the workforce, birth rates drop. Having large families is incompatible with middle class living. The quickest way to drop the birth rate is through rapid economic development. After World War II, the U.S. instituted a $600 tax credit per child. The idea was to enable mom and dad to have four children without being troubled by taxes. This led to a baby boom of 22 million kids, which was a huge consumer market that turned into a huge tax base. However, to match that incentive in today's dollars would cost $12,000 per child.

 

China and India do not have declining populations. However, in both countries, there is a preference for boys over girls, and we now have the technology to know which is which before they are born. In China and India , many families are aborting the girls. As a result, in each of these countries there are 70 million boys growing up who will never find wives. When left alone, nature produces 103 boys for every 100 girls. In some provinces, however, the ratio is 128 boys to every 100 girls. The birth rate in Russia is so low that by 2050 their population will be smaller than that of Yemen . Russia has one-sixth of the earth's land surface and much of its oil. You can't control that much area with such a small population. Immediately to the south, you have China with 70 million unmarried men are a real potential nightmare scenario for Russia

 

4. Restructuring of American Business

 

The fourth major transformation involves a fundamental restructuring of American business. Today's business environment is very complex and competitive. To succeed, you have to be the best, which means having the highest quality and lowest cost. Whatever your price point, you must have the best quality and lowest price. To be the best, you have to concentrate on one thing. You can't be all things to all people and be the best.

 

A generation ago, IBM used to make every part of their computer. Now Intel makes the chips, Microsoft makes the software, and someone else makes the modems, hard drives, monitors, etc. IBM even outsources their call center. Because IBM has all these companies supplying goods and services cheaper and better than they could do it themselves, they can make a better computer at a lower cost. This is called a fracturing of business. When one company can make a better product by relying on others to perform functions the business used to do itself, it creates a complex pyramid of companies that serve and support each other.

 

This fracturing of American business is now in its second generation. The companies who supply IBM are now doing the same thing-outsourcing many of their core services and production process. As a result, they can make cheaper, better products. Over time, this pyramid continues to get bigger and bigger. Just when you think it can't fracture again, it does. Even very small businesses can have a large pyramid of corporate entities that perform many of its important functions. One aspect of this trend is that companies end up with fewer employees and more independent contractors.

 

This trend has also created two new words in business integrator and complementor. At the top of the pyramid, IBM is the integrator. As you go down the pyramid, Microsoft, Intel and the other companies that support IBM are the complementors. However, each of the complementors is itself an integrator for the complementors underneath it. This has several implications, the first of which is that we are now getting false readings on the economy. People who used to be employees are now independent contractors launching their own businesses. There are many people working whose work is not listed as a job. As a result, the economy is perking along better than the numbers are telling us.

 

Outsourcing also confused the numbers. Suppose a company like General Motors decides to outsource all its employee cafeteria functions to Marriott (which it did). It lays off hundreds of cafeteria workers, who then get hired right back by Marriott. The only thing that has changed is that these people work for Marriott rather than GM. Yet, the headlines will scream that America has lost more manufacturing jobs. All that really happened is that these workers are now reclassified as service workers. So the old way of counting jobs contributes to false economic readings. As yet, we haven't figured out how to make the numbers catch up with the changing realities of the business world.

 

Another implication of this massive restructuring is that because companies are getting rid of units and people that used to work for them, the entity is smaller. As the companies get smaller and more efficient, revenues are going down but profits are going up. As a result, the old notion that revenues are up and we're doing great isn't always the case anymore. Companies are getting smaller but are becoming more efficient and profitable in the process.

 

IMPLICATIONS OF THE FOUR TRANSFORMATIONS

 

1. The War in Iraq

 

In some ways, the war is going very well. Afghanistan and Iraq have the beginnings of a modern government, which is a huge step forward. The Saudis are starting to talk about some good things, while Egypt and Lebanon are beginning to move in a good direction. A series of revolutions have taken place in countries like Ukraine and Georgia. There will be more of these revolutions for an interesting reason. In every revolution, there comes a point where the dictator turns to the general and says, Fire into the crowd. If the general fires into the crowd, it stops the revolution. If the general says No, the revolution continues. Increasingly, the generals are saying No because their kids are in the crowd.

 

Thanks to TV and the Internet, the average 18-year old outside the U.S. is very savvy about what is going on in the world, especially in terms of popular culture. There is a huge global consciousness, and young people around the world want to be a part of it. It is increasingly apparent to them that the miserable government where they live is the only thing standing in their way. More and more, it is the well-educated kids, the children of the generals and the elite, who are leading the revolutions.

 

At the same time, not all is well with the war. The level of violence in Iraq is much worse and doesn't appear to be improving. It's possible that we're asking too much of Islam all at one time. We're trying to jolt them from the 7th century to the 21st century all at once, which may be further than they can go. They might make it and they might not. Nobody knows for sure. The point is, we don't know how the war will turn out. Anyone who says they know is just guessing.

 

The real place to watch is Iran . If they actually obtain nuclear weapons it will be a terrible situation. There are two ways to deal with it. The first is a military strike, which will be very difficult. The Iranians have dispersed their nuclear development facilities and put them underground. The U.S. has nuclear weapons that can go under the earth and take out those facilities, but we don't want to do that. The other way is to separate the radical mullahs from the government, which is the most likely course of action.

 

Seventy percent of the Iranian population is under 30. They are Moslem but not Arab. They are mostly pro-Western. Many experts think the U.S. should have dealt with Iran before going to war with Iraq. The problem isn't so much the weapons, it's the people who control them. If Iran has a moderate government, the weapons become less of a concern. We don't know if we will win the war in Iraq. We could lose or win. What we're looking for is any indicator that Islam is moving in to the 21st century and stabilizing.

 

2. China

 

It may be that pushing 500 million people from farms and villages into cities is too much too soon. Although it gets almost no publicity, China is experiencing hundreds of demonstrations around the country, which is unprecedented. These are not students in Tiananmen Square. These are average citizens who are angry with the government for building chemical plants and polluting the water they drink and the air they breathe. The Chinese are a smart and industrious people. They may be able to pull it off and become a very successful economic and military superpower. If so, we will have to learn to live with it. If they want to share the responsibility of keeping the world's oil lanes open, that's a good thing. They currently have eight new nuclear electric power generators under way and 45 on the books to build. Soon, they will leave the U.S. way behind in their ability to generate nuclear power.

 

What can go wrong with China ? For one, you can't move 550 million people into the cities without major problems. Two , China really wants Taiwan , not so much for economic reasons, they just want it. The Chinese know that their system of communism can't survive much longer in the 21st century. The last thing they want to do before they morph into some sort of more capitalistic government is to take over Taiwan

 

We may wake up one morning and find they have launched an attack on Taiwan If so, it will be a mess, both economically and militarily. The U.S. has committed to the military defense of Taiwan. If China attacks Taiwan, will we really go to war against them? If the Chinese generals believe the answer is no, they may attack. If we don't defend Taiwan , every treaty the U.S. has will be worthless. Hopefully, China won't do anything stupid.

 

3. Demographics

 

Europe and Japan are dying because their populations are aging and shrinking. These trends can be reversed if the young people start breeding. However, the birth rates in these areas are so low it will take two generations to turn things around. No economic model exists that permits 50 years to turn things around. Some countries are beginning to offer incentives for people to have bigger families. For example, Italy is offering tax breaks for having children. However, it's a lifestyle issue versus a tiny amount of money. Europeans aren't willing to give up their comfortable lifestyles in order to have more children.

 

In general, everyone in Europe just wants it to last a while longer. Europeans have a real talent for living. They don't want to work very hard. The average European worker gets 400 more hours of vacation time per year than Americans. They don't want to work and they don't want to make any of the changes needed to revive their economies. The summer after 9/11, France lost 15,000 people in a heat wave. In August, the country basically shuts down when everyone goes on vacation. That year, a severe heat wave struck and 15,000 elderly people living in nursing homes and hospitals died. Their children didn't even leave the beaches to come back and take care of the bodies. Institutions had to scramble to find enough refrigeration units to hold the bodies until people came to claim them.

 

This loss of life was five times bigger than 9/11 in America, yet it didn't trigger any change in French society. When birth rates are so low, it creates a tremendous tax burden on the young. Under those circumstances, keeping mom and dad alive is not an attractive option. That's why euthanasia is becoming so popular in most European countries. The only country that doesn't permit (and even encourage) euthanasia is Germany, because of all the baggage from World War II.

 

The European economy is beginning to fracture. The Euro is down. Countries like Italy are starting to talk about pulling out of the European Union because it is killing them. When things get bad economically in Europe, they tend to get very nasty politically. The canary in the mine is anti-Semitism. When it goes up, it means trouble is coming. Current levels of anti-Semitism are higher than ever. Germany won't launch another war, but Europe will likely get shabbier, more dangerous and less pleasant to live in.

 

Japan has a birth rate of 1.3 and has no intention of bringing in immigrants. By 2020, one out of every five Japanese will be 70 years old. Property values in Japan have dropped every year for the past 14 years. The country is simply shutting down.

 

In the U.S. we also have an aging population. Boomers are starting to retire at a massive rate. These retirements will have several major impacts: Possible massive sell-off of large four-bedroom houses and a movement to condos. An enormous drain on the treasury. Boomers vote, and they want their benefits, even if it means putting a crushing tax burden on their kids to get them. Social Security will be a huge problem. As this generation ages, it will start to drain the system. We are the only country in the world where there are no age limits on medical procedures. An enormous drain on the health care system. This will also increase the tax burden on the young, which will cause them to delay marriage and having families, which will drive down the birth rate even further.

 

Although scary, these demographics also present enormous opportunities for products and services tailored to aging populations. There will be tremendous demand for caring for older people, especially those who don't need nursing homes but need some level of care. Some people will have a business where they take care of three or four people in their homes. The demand for that type of service and for products to physically care for aging people will be huge.

 

Make sure the demographics of your business are attuned to where the action is. For example, you don't want to be a baby food company in Europe or Japan. Demographics are much underrated as an indicator of where the opportunities are. Businesses need customers. Go where the customers are.

 

4. Restructuring of American Business

 

The restructuring of American business means we are coming to the end of the age of the employer and employee. With all this fracturing of businesses into different and smaller units, employers can't guarantee jobs anymore because they don't know what their companies will look like next year. Everyone is on their way to becoming an independent contractor. The new workforce contract will be, a show up at the my office five days a week and do what I want you to do, but you handle your own insurance, benefits, health care and everything else.

 

Husbands and wives are becoming economic units. They take different jobs and work different shifts depending on where they are in their careers and families. They make tradeoffs to put together a compensation package to take care of the family. This used to happen only with highly educated professionals with high incomes. Now it is happening at the level of the factory floor worker. Couples at all levels are designing their compensation packages based on their individual needs. The only way this can work is if everything is portable and flexible, which requires a huge shift in the American economy.

 

The U.S. is in the process of building the world's first 21st century model economy. The only other countries doing this are U.K. and Australia The model is fast, flexible, highly productive and unstable in that it is always fracturing and re-fracturing. This will increase the economic gap between the U.S. and everybody else, especially Europe and Japan .

 

At the same time, the military gap is increasing. Other than China, we are the only country that is continuing to put money into their military. Plus, we are the only military getting on-the-ground military experience through our war in Iraq. We know which high-tech weapons are working and which ones aren't. There is almost no one who can take us on economically or militarily. There has never been a superpower in this position before. On the one hand, this makes the U.S. a magnet for bright and ambitious people. It also makes us a target. We are becoming one of the last holdouts of the traditional Judeo-Christian culture. There is no better place in the world to be in business and raise children. The U.S. is by far the best place to have an idea, form a business and put it into the marketplace. We take it for granted, but it isn't as available in other countries of the world.

 

Ultimately, it's an issue of culture. The only people who can hurt us are ourselves, by losing our culture. If we give up our Judeo-Christian culture, we become just like the Europeans. The culture war is the whole ballgame. If we lose it, there isn't another America to pull us out.

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I poked around a little on the web but couldn't find an analysis Meyer's essay.  That surprises me.

I was interested to learn from Meyer that Europeans don't want to work.   I also didn't realize that unchecked population growth is unambiguously a good thing.  Also, I didn't know that euthanasia is becoming so popular in Europe because Europeans don't want to have to take care of mom and dad.  When I recently talked about stuff like this with a professor/friend from the Netherlands, he made a big point about how well his elederly mother was being cared for by the Dutch social system (must be an anomaly that she hasn't been euthanized yet).  I'm also a little skeptical that the US is the only country with a strong, resilient economy.

Anyway, in case you missed this little gem, an editorial in today's Midland Daily News:

A little less pride

To the editor:

Recently I realized that I no longer have the same pride of being an American that I once had. It occurred as I was hoisting my flag one morning, just as I have done every morning for many years.

I am a member of that group referred to by Tom Brokaw as the "Greatest Generation." He credits us with "coming of age during the Great Depression and the second World War and going on to build modern America -- men and women whose everyday lives of duty, honor, achievement and courage gave us the world we have today."

Proud as I am of being in that group, I believe that Brokaw missed by one generation. Our parents managed somehow to prepare us for all those accomplishments, and they did it with little education, hard times and more adversity than we can imagine today. But they had a tenacity to rear a generation that they knew would be able to succeed. In my opinion, they are the greatest generation, not us.

My generation mobilized when it found itself at war. Men and some women went into the armed services fully aware that they were putting their lives on the line. Those men who could not enter the military because of age or physical limitations went to work in the war plants, along with women who filled the vacancies caused by the absence of men who had gone into the service. They worked all the overtime necessary to produce war materials needed for our forces as well as our allies. Older men volunteered as air raid wardens. They shared those things which were in short supply, such as gasoline, shoes, coffee and sugar by means of rationing. They bought war bonds with their overtime pay. Teenagers collected scrap metal to recycle, and with the proceeds bought defense stamps for 25 cents each until they accumulated $18.75 worth, which they then exchanged for a bond. My father worked a shift in two different war plants every day. I remember visiting my mother when I was home on furlough. She was operating a turret lathe in a factory. She proudly hung a banner with three blue stars on it in her front window. Many windows had a banner with a gold star on it signifying a family member killed in the war.

Casualty rates were high compared with figures from the current conflict. More than twice as many men were killed in five weeks on Iwo Jima than all the deaths in the Iraq/Afghanistan war for the whole four years our troops have been there. Everyone supported the war and the president. Trash talk such as we hear today would have been considered treasonous.

Americans today oppose the war not because they lack disfavor with their enemy's ideology, but simply because they find the war inconvenient. We have grown so affluent and satisfied that we now find the war to be a big bother. As a nation, we have nowhere near the resolve necessary to conduct a winning effort. Perhaps that is the fault of my generation. We won our war and came home determined that our children would never have to endure the adversities that we had. We did everything we could to make their lives easy and comfortable. As a result we raised a generation of sissies, ill equipped to handle a war. They in their turn compounded the error by raising a generation even more lily livered than themselves. Unfortunately, they are the generation now running the country.

When the Romans became so fat and sassy that they no longer cared to support their armies, they lost their empire. Following Napoleon's defeat the French became a nation of pansies, from which they have never recovered. Three times in less than a century they have had to fight the Germans. Two of those times they had to be rescued by the Americans.

We seem to have learned nothing from history. But fortunately we have a small cadre of people who have the Spartan resolve needed to carry on. They are the members of our armed forces. They are superior to the average American character physically, intellectually and morally. They recognize that the reason they are fighting is to retard the spread of radical Islam. I believe that President Bush knew that at the time he took us into the war, but that he used the pretext of eliminating weapons of mass destruction instead because he was afraid of offending the sensitivity of the pusillanimous American public. It is no secret that the objective of Islam is to take over the world. They have been completely open about that aim for more than a millennium. Even though the Islamic nations cannot get along with each other politically, as Muslims they are united in their zeal to take over the world by the sword, just as they have since their birth as a religion. Unlike us they do have the drive, the desire and the will to succeed. I am glad that I am so old that I will not live to see that happen.

So I will continue to hoist my flag every morning, but sadly with reduced pride. I will still stand for the singing of the national anthem even though it seems appropriate to change the words of the last line to say "o'er the land of the free and the home of the chicken."

TED KILLINGER

Midland

 

The war in Iraq is not at all painful.  Here is my reasoning.

1. Does our 21st century civilization need a Saddam Hussein?  Answer: No

2. Do the Iraqies still want us to help them?  Answer: YES - VERY MUCH SO.

3. Does this effort serve the interest of the greater good? Answer: Yes (see 1)

4. Would I go there myself to fight? Answer: Yes - ready to go when Uncle Sam calls.  Could use the exercise anyway.

5. Do I care that the media is against this?  Answer: No

6. Do I believe things would be worse if Saddam were still in power?  Answer: YES!!!

7. Do I believe the Iraqies can win back their nation?  Answer: Yes and looking better every day.

8. Does Iran worry me? Answer: No

This is the very practical reclamation of a nation that has long been suppressed by a dictator who extracted all the wealth of his nation and dismissed all the intelligentsia for decades.  This will take time, money, and yes valuable lives.  Why aren't the people of Iraq worth it?

Finally, there is plenty of evidence that Saddam had WOMD (e.g., Sarin contaning bomb exploded near U.S. military convoys, May 17, 2004) - bottom line is that the peaceful people of the world do not need this. 

Joey

Yes, Sadam was a bad, bad man. Given the current situation in Iraq (until the time comes when the rosy view advanced by the Bush admin starts to have a slight hint that it is based on reality, I refuse to compare pre-war Sadam in power with post-war how things might be decades from now), is Iraq, the US, the rest of the world better off before or after the war? As you put it, has the interest of the greater good been served? It's very hard for me to tell that it has. It seems to me that we've pretty much gone from one terrible situation to another. A modern, secular country (admittedly run by a ruthless dictator) has been destroyed and replaced with the chaos of religious conflict where people like al Sadr are the ones really in control, the cycle of bloodthirsty violence and revenge reigns, serving as a highly effective terrorist recruiting tool. All at the cost of the lives of tens to hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians, thousand of American soldiers, hundreds of billions of American dollars, and much international goodwill that we were given after the Sept 11 attack. Today the USA Today reports (link) that in the Sha'ab district of northern Baghdad 70 % of the school children "suffer symptoms of trauma-related stress such as bed-wetting or stuttering" because they "...have to pass dead bodies on the street as they walk to school in the morning, according to a separate report last week by the International Red Cross. Others have seen relatives killed or have been injured in mortar or bomb attacks." You mention the intelligentsia...I don't think they're feeling so good right now as they have become prime targets.

And I really don't get the "looking better every day" comment. What is the data to support that claim? McCain recently made such comments after a stroll through Baghdad. It was later revealed that he wore a kevlar vest and was supported by tens of soldiers, humvees, helicopters, etc. A day or two a later a bombing kills tens of Iraqis in the same market. Last Thursday a suicide bomber strikes the cafeteria in the green zone. We've given up any commitment to rebuild Iraq. Has the surge reduced violence or just pushed it elsewhere it elsewhere in the country? Even if it is actually reduced, it is still way to high and we can't afford neither the number or troops nor their stay to be long enough to have a realistic chance of a surge solution working in the long term.

I believe the standing of the US on the world stage has taken a major hit, we have lost the moral high ground (e.g. Abu Ghraib and Guantanimo), and as James Fallows wrote in The Atlantic Monthly (as summarized in The Week magazine in Sept of 06):

Despite ominous talk of mushroom clouds in U.S. cities, it's highly unlikely that terrorists could build or buy a nuke and smuggle it into the country. That leaves terrorists with one means of inflicting major damage on the superpower: Baiting us into foolishly damaging our own interests. The Bush administration has fallen into this trap, by invading Iraq, killing Muslim civilians, and playing into al Qaida's narrative. Portraying the war as an epic clash of civilizations only feeds the terrorists' false grandiosity-and drives Muslim moderates into the extremists' hands. Terrorists may yet again strike on U.S. soil, but the reality is that we've essentially won the war. The sooner we recognize this, the sooner our policies will be motivated by strategic self-interest, instead of by terror.

I'm also not all that concerned about the media's view either...but that's how the data about Iraq gets to us, and the data suggests that the situation in Iraq is horrible.

By removing Sadam by external force with no satisfactory plan what to do next, we created a vacuum that has been filled with some else that is also very bad...at great cost to us (and distraction from the real "war on terror" without addressing, and actually fomenting, its underlying causes.

I don't believe we are getting all the data.  Nevertheless, when a reporter makes the effort to see that the people of Iraq are entrepreneurial, want to live in a peaceful society, want self determination, and want freedom then we see that the majority view is far different from the view we get from the press or some out-of-touch politician who is given a certain view.

Let's be very careful about forming opinions based on what we see on the nightly news.  (I know you are a better thinker anyway.)

I just cannot make the leap of faith stating that "life would have been better under Saddam".  Even if the road to self determination is tough - it is a better road.

Joey

Of course we're not getting all the data.  It's not a safe place to collect the data.  A listening recommendation: there was a really interesting segment of the "This American Life" radio show about how researchers went about trying to get a statistically significant estimate of the number of Iraqi civilian deaths (link). 

The picture we get will never be perfect, regardless.

But the data like numbers of Iraqi deaths, numbers of Iraqis arrested, numbers of American deaths, numbers of bombings, state of basic infrastructure and public services, infiltration of police and army by insurgents, etc. speak for themselves.  As reported by the NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc...these numbers are not in dispute.  I don't believe I'm being deceived about these facts.  In my opinion, the "getting better every day" view is based on wishful thinking and is out of touch with reality.  Even if things are getting better, the fact is that they are now horrible and that the possible existence of tiny incremental improvements is not what is relevant.

I'm not necessarily claiming that Iraq was better off under Sadam.  I'm claiming that Iraq has gone from one horrible situation to another...from the tyranny of a murderous dictator to the tyranny of murderous sectarian religious conflict...and that this zero sum game was not worth what it has cost us and them to impose this "freedom" from the outside.

Jonathan,

Why is it that "the numbers" you refer to between 2003 and 2006 are more valid than "the numbers" that I am referring to between 1979 and 2003?

You say you refuse to consider all the past but then you ask me to consider the most recent past?

What's the logic here?

Thanks,

Joey

I'm not refusing to consider past numbers.  I refuse to consider the "we're just starting to make progress", "the insurgency is in its last throes", type of thinking that tries paint an unrealistically positive face on the current disaster.

As I've tried to communicate, I understand that Sadam did many bad things between 1979 and 2003.  How many people did he kill or torture?  I don't know, but too many.  The Lancet study estimates 650,000 dead civilians as a result of the current conflict.  I'm sure that number is controversial, but whatever the number is I'm confident that it is too large for me flippantly say, "but it was worth it."  Then there is the cost in American lives, hundreds of billions of dollars, and an overstretched military.

Repeating myself, we've gone from one horrible situation to another horrible situation at great cost to us and them.  Not the kind of progress that makes me comfortable.

4 Bombings Kill 157 People in Baghdad: link

BAGHDAD (AP) - Four large bombs exploded in mostly Shiite areas of Baghdad on Wednesday, killing at least 157 people and wounding scores as violence climbed toward levels seen before the U.S.-Iraqi campaign to pacify the capital began two months ago.

In the deadliest of the attacks, a parked car bomb detonated in a crowd of workers at the Sadriyah market in central Baghdad, killing at least 112 people and wounding 115, said Raad Muhsin, an official at Al-Kindi Hospital where the victims were taken.

A police official confirmed the toll, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information.

Among the dead were several construction workers who had been rebuilding the mostly Shiite marketplace after a bombing destroyed many shops and killed 137 people there in February, the police official said.

 

 

Jonathan,

What you present is an event and not an assessment of the situation.  This is exactly how the mainstream media would like you to make decisions - based on all the bad news they can find - you should know this.  This is not an assessment or even an indication of the state of affairs in Iraq.

I have to buy an article from last Friday's Wall Street Journal and will post it when I get it, which, I believe, will present an assessment by a journalist who has visited Iraq over 8 times in the past two years.

Surely, the assessment is not all good, but at least it allows for an informed decision.

Let's hold until we can read this.

Ironically, we now see the rest of the world's news sources feeding their citizenry the proclamation that the United States is in imminent decline because of the shooting at Virgina Tech.  You and I both know that what happened at VT is an event upon which it makes no sense to assess the stability of the United States.  Even knee-jerk liberals should have also noted that the prime minister of Japan was fired upon in Nagasaki by a gunman (same day) in a nation with much more rigorous gun control laws.  Should I also assess Japan as now being inherently unstable? 

Joey

Joey,

Apparently you believe the "mainstream media" are conspiring to deceive us.  I do not.  I believe the "mainstream media" is neither trying to deceive me nor is actually doing so.  I pay attention to news from all of the major news sources (Drudge included).  I'm sure there is much I don't understand about Iraq, but I think I have a reasonable idea about what is going on.

I'd be glad to read the WSJ article you suggest.  I think it's highly unlikely that anything it will say will make me feel good about a situation where a bombing killing >100 is not an unusual occurrence.  I agree with you that an unusual occurrence like VT shootings doesn't tell us too much about the US.

I've been collecting some data on Iraq during the last month. Not comprehensive but representative, I think. It's not necessarily all bad news...some hints of good...BUT mostly bad.

 

April 2: the war in the words of the dead - link
April 5: by a 2 to 1 margin, Iraqis belief life is better today than under Saddam - link
April 6: Captured Iraqi documents and intelligence interrogations of Saddam Hussein and two former aides "all confirmed" that Hussein's regime was not directly cooperating with al-Qaeda before the U.S. invasion of Iraq - link
April 21: Bush argues that the surge is working as violence slows in Baghdad and Anbar province - link
April 22: top US officers see mixed results from surge - link
April 23: 9 soldiers killed - link
April 23: parallels to Vietnam, Lebanon, and Somalia - link
April 24: Al-Maliki support eroding in Iraq, Officials doubt he can unite factions - link
April 29: in a sampling of eight projects that the United States had declared successes, seven were no longer operating as designed because of plumbing and electrical failures, etc. - link
April 30: US death toll in April surpasses 100 - link
April 30: "a rare success story" Col. McFarland has some success in Ramadi - link
April 30: "some glimmers of hope", e.g. Ramadi and Petraeus taking over - link
May 1: Sunni ministers threaten to quit cabinet - link
May 6: 8 soldiers killed; 42 civillians killed in market blast - link
May 10: A majority of members of Iraq's parliament have signed a draft bill that would require a timetable for the withdrawal of U.S. soldiers from Iraq and freeze current troop levels - link
May 10: Iraqi lawmaker's plan to take 2-month vacation starting July 1 - link
May 13: 5 soldiers killed in ambush - link
May 15: kidnapped soldiers held by Al-Qaeda and 6 more soldiers die - link
May 18: 5 soldiers and 2 journalists die in Baghdad and Diyala - link
May 19: > 146 contractors killed in the 1st Q of 2007, nearly 1,000 dead and 12,000 wounded and nearly 3,400 US soldiers dead since war began - link
May 21: One building that's been built on time and on budget in Iraq: America's fortress embassy - link
May 21: 7 soldiers and an interpreter killed, > 24 Iraqis killed - link
May 22: Iran fighting proxy war to push US out of Iraq - link
May 23: US troops working with local tribes are having success against Al Qaeda in Anbar province, Shi'ite factions have little interest in making concessions to the Sunnis - link
May 24: body of 1 of 3 missing soldiers found floating in the Euphrates, 9 soldiers were killed the previous Mon and Tues in bombings and shootings - link
May 24: sectarian killings are rising again, though they haven't reached last years highest levels - link
May 26: 7 more troops die - link

 

Jonathan,

Thanks for the summary.  I have noticed more of-late and your notes concur that Al Qaeda has a presence in Iraq and this presence is being sought out and removed via US military force.  Recent examples include senior members of the Al Qaeda organization. Thjis seems to be a very nice outcome to me. 

Second, the conflict between the Sunnis and the Shi'ites is certainly a pivotal element (really between the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and Iran).  What terms are possible?

I know I promised a Wall Street Journal Article - still trying to find time.

Regards,

Joey

In my opinion, it's the Iraqis who have to remove Al Qaeda from Iraq.  I don't think we can do it.

- just kidding, no such luck...

 seriously: not being an american, i lack a say in this particular forum. but i would agree with Jonathan that it's the Iraqis who'd have to do the removing. at this point, though, i think the Iraqis are not a single people determined to throw out al-Qaeda, or even bury the grudges they hold against each other. the U.S. can only help to support or maintain efforts that are willed by the Iraqi people. however, i think the Iraqi people as such doesn't exist (what exists are Kurds, Shiites, Sunnis, Baathists, ...) and therefore doesn't have a discernible, unified will.

 reminds me of myself trying to broker peace between my sons: whatever peace i come up with is enforced, and when i leave the room, there's a thud, followed by a howl, and the brawl starts up again. the U.S. can't stay there forever, 

and when the bad guys rush in to fill the void, it'll be worse than Saddam would've ever been.

Jonathan and Peter,

I clearly miscommunicated in my last post.  The point is that Al Qaeda is operating in Iraq. I thought Al Qaeda was the enemy (i.e., 9/11). Albeit, no harm done in removing Saddam.

My point stems from the fact that I have seen more reports about Al Qaeda from Iraq than I really anticipated.

js
Yes, that is one of our accomplishments...bringing Al Qaeda to Iraq.

Joey,

 

See my April 6 highlight from the WaPo (link ). The first two paragraphs:

 

Hussein's Prewar Ties To Al-Qaeda Discounted
Pentagon Report Says Contacts Were Limited

By R. Jeffrey Smith
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, April 6, 2007; Page A01


Captured Iraqi documents and intelligence interrogations of Saddam Hussein and two former aides "all confirmed" that Hussein's regime was not directly cooperating with al-Qaeda before the U.S. invasion of Iraq, according to a declassified Defense Department report released yesterday.

The declassified version of the report, by acting Inspector General Thomas F. Gimble, also contains new details about the intelligence community's prewar consensus that the Iraqi government and al-Qaeda figures had only limited contacts, and about its judgments that reports of deeper links were based on dubious or unconfirmed information. The report had been released in summary form in February.

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